I may want to create a RIA but am wondering, whether Adobe AIR or Titanium is the way to go.
Do you think the open source version will last longer? Will it be better in anyway?
Just in case anyone comes back to this post, I'll add my 2 cents.
Titanium has come along way in the last few months. It now has support for Ruby and Python. You can code your own modules in C++ (eg, IRC) and compile Titanium to have support for that module (Or you can code modules in Py/Ru/JS).
You can use flex, flash and silverlight all within Titanium. All have been tested and work without a hitch :)
Although AIR isn't open source yet, the technology stack it's on (Flex, Webkit, etc) is open source. Titanium definitely looks promising but has no where near the momentum and support AIR has yet. Until it's been actually released and has several production apps running on it I wouldn't bet too much on it.If you're looking to get involved in an open source project and actually work and help develop it that's something else...
Just to clarify, AIR lets you use HTML/js to build your apps as well.
Neither, as both technologies are for creating desktop applications not RIAs.
Now if you were to ask how should you build your RIA... so that when, if, it comes to a point of you making a desktop version, which technology should you use, Flex or Javascript/HTML?
The answer becomes obvious once you decide between Flex or Javascript/HTML. If you do Flex then your desktop application will be in AIR; If you do Javascript/HTML your Descktop app will be in Titanium.
My suggestion, go with Flex - Air. Both are environments where State is made easy. Flex are written much like client (desktop) applications anyway as they have state.
Related
I'm a developer in ActionScript and while I'm watching Haxe as a language to be used by me, since besides the resemblance ActionScript, still be possible to make applications with output to flash yet.
However I have a question about building AIR packages. When I search about building AIR applications with Haxe, the search does not bring satisfactory results.
I ask, after the codification and development of the code (in Haxe), how is it possible to transform what was built into an AIR package?
Thank you!
It isn't a very popular topic it seems. Anyhow, as far as I remember my experience building it some years ago, what you need would be:
If you need some air-specific APIs then you should write externs for them. There is this existing project, but it would need a bit of update as it was written for flash9, however, I believe it is doable in like 1 hour of work.
Compile to flash.
Write all the manifests you need for Air. (Sorry, don't remember what exactly it needs.)
Use this guides to package(also test and sign) your apps.
Note: If you want to go the same way you did before, you could compile haxe to as3 and be happy. However, I wouldn't recommend this method due to loosing speed and probable implications which may arrive.
I need to build a fairly simple app but it needs to work on both PC and Mac.
It also needs to be redistributable on a disc or usb drive as a standalone desktop app.
Initially I thought AIR would be perfect for this (it ticks all the API requirements), but the difficulty is making it distributable, as the app would require the AIR runtime to be installed to run.
I came across Shu Player as an option as it seems to be able to package the AIR runtime with the app and do a (silent?) install.
However this seems to break the T&C from Adobe (as outlined here) so I'm not sure about the legality.
Another option could be Zinc but I haven't tested it so I'm not sure how well it'll fit the bill.
What would you recommend or suggest I check out?
Any suggestion much appreciated
EDIT:
There's a few more discussions on mono usage (though no real conclusion):
Here and Here
EDIT2:
Titanium could also fit the bill maybe, will check it out.
Any more comments from anyone?
EDIT3 (one year on): It's actually been almost a year since I posted that question but it seems some people still come across it every now and then, and even contribute an answer, even a year later.
Thought I'd update the question a bit. I did not get around to try the tcl/tk option at the end, time constraint and the uncertainty of the compatibility to different os versions led me to discard that as an option.
I did try Titanium for a bit but though the first impressions were ok, they really are pushing the mobile platform more than anything, and imho, the desktop implementation suffers a bit from that lack of attention. There are also some report of problems with some visual studio runtime on some OSs (can't remember the details now though).. So discarded that too.
I ended up going with XULRunner. The two major appeals were:
Firefox seems to work out of the box on most OS version, so I took it as good faith that a XULRunner app would likely be compatible with most system. Saved me a lot of testing and it turned out that it did run really well on all platforms, there hasn't been a single report of not being able to start the app
It's Javascript baby! Language learning curve was minimal. The main thing to work out is what the additional xpcom interfaces are and how to query them.
On the down side:
I thought troubleshooting errors was a sometimes difficult task, the venkman debugger is kinda clunky, ended up using the console more than anything.
The sqlite interface is a great asset for a desktop app but I often struggled to find relevant error infos when something didn't work - maybe i was doing it wrong.
It took a little while to work out how to package the app as a standalone app for both PC and Mac. The final approach was to have a "shell" mac app and a shell pc app and a couple of "compile" script that would copy the shells and add the custom source code onto it in the correct location.
One last potential issue for some, due to the nature of xulrunner apps, your source code will be deployed with the app, you can use obfuscation if you want but that's something to keep in mind if you want to protect your intellectual property
All in all, great platform for a cross-platform app. I'd highly recommend it.
Tcl/Tk has one of the best packaging solutions out there. You can easily wrap a cross-platform application (implemented in a fully working virtual filesystem) with a platform-specific binary to get a single file executable for just about any modern desktop system. Search google for the terms starkit, starpack and tclkit. Such wrapped binaries are tiny in comparison to many executables these days.
Many deride Tk as being "old" or "immature" but it's one of the oldest, most stable toolkits out there. It uses native widgets when such widgets exist.
One significant drawback of Tcl/Tk, however, is that it lacks any sort of printing support. If your application needs to print you'll have to be a bit creative. There are platform-specific solutions, and the ability to generate postscript documents, and libraries to create pdfs, but it takes a little extra effort.
Java is probably your best bet, although not all Windows PCs will necessarily have Java (most should). JavaFX is new enough you can't count on it - you'll probably find a lot of machines running Java 1.5 or (shudder) 1.4. I believe recent Mac OS still ships with 1.5 (latest version may have changed to 1.6).
Consider JavaFX
It would run everywhere with a modern JRE ..!
AIR could be an option, but only if you don't mind distributing two different files (the offline runtime installer and your app), and expecting the user to run one and then the other. You do have to submit an online form at Adobe's site saying you agree to distribute the offline installer as-is, rather than digging out individual DLLs or whatever, before they give you the installer.
Unfortunately there's currently no way to get both an AIR app and the runtime to install from one file though. I'm not sure what the deal with Shu is, or whether it's doing anything that isn't kosher.
i would recommended zink. it has all the functionalities you require for desktop. however, the las time i used it it was a bit glitchy.
i was hung up by trying to write a 6M file to the disk. thought it trough and changed the code to write 512K chunks at a time (3min work, fast).
probably it still has some little annoying glitches like making you think on root lvl but the ease of use and the features are just way too sweet to ignore.
I am looking to make a Mac version of one of my iPhone apps and was looking for a good ay to hit the ground running. I know how to code in Objective-c and Cocoa, and I know how to piece something together from scratch if I have to, but I am looking for an easier way.
Are there any open-source templates for coding Mac desktop applications that I might be able to pick up and use to get started off without reinventing the wheel?
EDIT:
I guess what I am looking for is an easy way to get started on an app that has the "iTunes Look and Feel". If there are some bare-bones version of this layout as some sort of template project, that would be great. Also, why has somebody down-voted this question? Have I asked something that is not appropriate for SO?
Apple includes lots of project templates with Xcode (vanilla application, document-based application, Core Data document-based application, etc.). I don't really know how much more you would want in a template. They're generally pretty good for getting you started, I think. If you're looking for something more than these offer out of a "template," maybe you could elaborate.
If you're just looking for a starting point for the interface, then check out BW Toolkit:
http://brandonwalkin.com/bwtoolkit/
He has some nice videos on his site showing how to create a Mail-like interface very quickly.
Besides the project templates included with Xcode, you should browse the application exmples in /Developer/Examples. Most of these examples are "full" applications that demonstrate one or more Cocoa-related concepts. Many could serve as the starting point for a similarly orriented app of your own.
I have a Symbian 9.1 handset, Nokia E65, based on Nokia S60 series UI. I'd like to build a simple, full screen, graphic application. It should be able to display some text and pictures and have a basic interaction from the keyboard. That's for me only, not to be deployed.
Now, what do you think is the quickest and most painless way to have it done?
I have the following skills:
- HTML, PHP, ASP.net, JS
- ASP.net and C#, Silverlight
- Java, but mostly for networking, not UI
- Some C++
I have downloaded the Nokia IDE, but it is scary at first sight :)
Any tutorial or example are welcome!
Edit:
In particular, two questions:
is there a possibility to make a stand-alone flash application for that handset?
how about the QT mobile version?
For your device, definitely use Python for S60. It is much easier to start with than Symbian's C++ SDK and in case you ever need more low level functionality than python gives you, you can write small modules in c++ and use them in your Python program.
For a simple application like the one you are describing, Python will do just fine. You don't even need any of Nokia's IDEs / tools on the PC, you can just write the code in any text editor, copy it to the phone and test it live.
As others have mentioned, other options include:
Symbian C++ SDK : As you have discovered the tools and not the most intuitive to work with, development is not straight forward either.
Nokia's WRT : Using javascript/css/html, but it is not available for your phone.
Qt : Not available for your phone.
Java Me : Probably your second best option, your code will be slightly larger but more protable. The tools are not as straight forward as with Python, but definitely not as complicated as with Symbian.
If you think you may like to do some further development on the Symbian platform in future, I'd strongly suggest looking at Qt. Unfortunately, however, you can't use it on your E65, since Qt requires S60 3.1 or higher. (The E65 runs S60 3.0).
Since Qt coding in done in C++, you also have access to native platform APIs if required. For most apps however, the (considerably more user-friendly) Qt APIs provide all the functionality you need.
Depending on your background, the learning curve may be steeper than using Java or Python, but the pay-off is that you get access to a very powerful toolkit. And of course, as long as you use only Qt APIs, your app should be easily portable to other Qt platforms if necessary.
Go for Java ME.
All the things you list in your post is possible to do in Java.
The Symbian SDK for C++ can be downloaded here.
NSBasic is another option.
Kindness,
Dan
May I suggest Python? For newer Symbian handsets I'd recommend Web Runtime (WRT), but it is not supported on good old E65.
I'm obviously biased but I would suggest getting the 2D graphics example code from the "Quick Recipes On Symbian OS" book:
If you know HTML and JS already, you should be able to write a Web widget for your Symbian device pretty easily, using the tools available through Forum Nokia. More info here:
http://www.forum.nokia.com/Technology_Topics/Web_Technologies/Web_Runtime/
These widgets are standalone full screen applications that use the device WebKit browser engine for rendering and UI. You can also use keyboard inputs and customize the softkeys if you wish.
I'm looking at rewriting an eMbedded Visual Basic app I wrote years ago. I'm unsatisified with it because of various problems clients keep having with it now and then over the years, mostly along the lines of the app not loading anymore because a required dll/activex control has gone missing! This is so frustrating and naturally difficult to debug when a client is using it far away. In alot of cases reinstalling the app doesn't fix the problem.
My preference would be to rewrite it in C# since I'm comfortable with C# and DotNet, but I'm also open to other platforms like blackberry or iTouch/iPhone so long as the platform can support maps and GPS. I'd start rewriting it in C# now but I can't be sure that I won't have the same problems in .net.
Has anyone else had similar problems with eVB apps which have gone away/persisted when moving to CF DotNet? Or would you suggest a different platform again?
Edit: Note that I wish to move away from eVB anyway, but if I move to CF DotNet I want to make sure I won't have the same missing dll/control problems.
I recommend .NET CF strongly, especially if you already know C# and .NET. Mono has been ported to the iPhone, so it is possible to write apps that will run on Windows Mobile and the iPhone. No Mono for Blackberry (yet, if ever), so that's a definite limitation. I personally can't stand Blackberries (I have both a Blackberry and a WM smartphone and the Blackberry makes me want to hang myself), but they do have a huge user base.
You should have migrated away from eVB years ago, but that's water under the bridge. If you want to continue targeting Windows CE/ Windows Mobile I'd recommend going to the CF - language is irrelevant, use what you're comfortable with.
There's no way to guarantee that whatever your "missing DLL" problem is won't happen again, since we have no idea what DLL went missing. If it was a 3rd party control, then you're at the mercy of the market. If the provider survives, it's likely their control will.
If you want to target iPhone/Blackberry then Java is more likely to be your language of choice - the tools I'm not as familiar with. Eclipse for Blackberry - iPhone may have their own tool.
As for Silverlight, you might look at it, but so far it's just way too slow to be a viable platform, at least on any WinMo device I've ever seen. We've delevered many, many CF apps for all sorts of verticals and have never had any usability problems (though we've been doing it a long time and know every limitation and what we should and should not be trying).
I suggest you take it one step further and look at Silverlight. One of the premises is that it's a more long-term-stable, portable, lightweight download and install, and it hasn't gotten krufty yet.
I think it has the potential to be the next VB for embedded. One of the difficulties with CF is that I've found it to be an insufficient subset of the real thing.
Another option is NS Basic/CE. It's highly compatible with eVB, so you will be able to keep most if not all of your code. The product has been continually updated so it runs on current devices.
The installer that NS Basic/CE creates includes all the dll files your program requires, so they will be included on installation.